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Post by Gunman_sr5 on Aug 13, 2006 1:19:57 GMT -5
Ok since it seems fans of the current Transformers lines are a bit more open minded. What do you think of the Idea of taking Optimus and Megatron out of the immediate lead of the factions. Instead have them as like icons in the background (trademark reasoning explanation), and create entirely new leaders. Sort of a way to totally reboot the story lines, and bring in new concepts. Yet another idea. Don't have them as icons. Start the line with unheard of characters. Just so near the end of the line Optimus can evolve into himself as Megatron is created. This idea could also eliminate humans on Cybertron. Or worst case scenario. Kill of Optimus and Megatron in the very beginning to never bring them back under any name, shape, or form.
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Post by CkRtech on Aug 13, 2006 1:23:07 GMT -5
Ok since it seems fans of the current Transformers lines are a bit more open minded. Uhhh...what? Meanwhile, I have been preaching for them to stop leeching off G1 for years now, but I will say again - Create something new! Try to make something that does not have: Optimus <something>, Megatron, Megatron turning into Galvatron, Unicron, Primus (whatever the heck that is), Cybertron, or the Matrix of Leadership. Please. Please learn some creativity.
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Post by Destro on Aug 13, 2006 1:54:01 GMT -5
It has little to do w/ creativity; it has everything to do w/ name recognition and marketing. Hasbro knows that if people know anything about tf's they know prime and megatron, besides the fact that if those two were gotten rid of fans would cry bloody murder. Also, if they don't use em, they lose em; the trademarks to the names, that is, and hastak obviously doesn't want that to happen.
They can change some of those things though; bw megs never became galvatron, rid didn't have unicron and neither did bw, are some I can think of. The others..well, I think they may be so ingrained in the tf mythos that if they were removed it would cause many fans to hate it (ie, bw "trukk not munky" fiasco); hasbro tried to change things up w/ that and got flak for it. They got flak for going a different way in killing off g1 prime. Both these instances had their downsides so I think hasbro is of the opinion that it should play it safe.
Also keep in mind that there really haven't been that many series beyond g1; you have the bw story (bw, bm, and the other beast toons in japan), rid, and then the a/e/c universe (not counting comics). Including g1, that's four different stories, and only three universes if you simply put the bw universe in w/ g1. So, imo, there really haven't been that many universes to explore so far.
I would like to see prime as a bruce wayne in a batman begins type of story, and maybe have megatron work his way to supreme commander of the decepticons or something. The problem is hasbro has been burned before, and is now afraid of the creative fire.
I honestly don't know if a line would succeed w/o prime and megs as the main characters; it'd be a tough sell.
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Post by Jo'Roq on Aug 13, 2006 10:56:21 GMT -5
I agree that not having Optimus and Megatron would be a nasty PR maze, but I do think it could be done if they get the right creative staff. (What happened to the writers for the new He-Man show?) Things worked well in BW to have Primal and Megs as low-levle commanders instead of the faction leaders, especially once it was established that Megatron was a renegade acting against his faction leaders.
Also, there are more than 4 universes if you include all the Japanese-only shows - Headmasters, Victory, and at least two others I can't remember the names for.
Anyway, the comparison to ST has been briefly brought up before (needs a break!), but here is my thought. When you ask any fan of TNG what the worst season was, nearly always you will be told that the first season was the worst. Why? One major reason is that the first season of TNG straight out stole a lot of stories from the Original Series. That's kind of how I see most of the post-G1 shows - they decided to create a "new" story using as many popular elements from G1 as they could work in, with just enough actual new content to make it a different show.
Whatever new show comes along after the movie, the usual story gimmicks need to be avoided:
- Megatron getting repainted and calling himself Galvatron. Megs-to-Galvy was cool the first time, but G1 also established Galvatron as a different character than Megatron as well.
- Unicron and Unicron/Primus. Again, neat idea the first time but now overdone to death.
- Gimmicky powers, a la Minicons and Planet Keys. While they are "cool" marketing gimmicks for kids, so far they have made for lousy story hooks. The shows need to get back to character-driven stories instead of predictable gimmicks.
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Post by Destro on Aug 13, 2006 14:15:47 GMT -5
I didn't include the japanese shows bc I thought we were talking about american/hasbro storylines.
The thing w/ megs to galvy as a repaint started w/ rid (sort of, since in japan the mold was slightly retooled and all we got was two color schemes of the retooled version), and I guess since it was easier to just repaint him that's what hastak did. I guess it made sense financially, but I would rather have a different physical form w/ a similar personality, not g1 megs to insane g1 galvy; if they were gonna change him that much they should've just made him a new character, not just megs reformatted and...nuts. BW megatron is a good example of how it should work, imo.
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Post by CkRtech on Aug 13, 2006 15:48:59 GMT -5
I guess they figure they can keep leeching off the G1 characters and plot by redoing the same story over and over and over because for some reason....people keep buying repaints of the same mold over and over and over and over and over and over.
Seriously though - Give it a break, let the movie happen, get a new creative team, and come back. They don't need to keep all of the same characters and storyline basis. They should never settle for "good enough." Things could be so much better.
The (copyrighted names) could be mixed-up to where transformers don't have the same basic rank and role. Ahh....screw it. I don't want to try to work out all of Hasbro's problems.
Innovation requires risk. You can look at the toy market & Hasbro's current role in the toy market - they really don't have anything super popular to lean on should they try something new with a line such as Transformers. They would need a new gimmick, a cartoon with an enjoyable storyline, and would need to start small in quantity to prevent huge losses.
That would be great - but really - I don't think the current Hasbro creative team has the ability to do something like that.
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Post by Destro on Aug 14, 2006 1:35:22 GMT -5
I guess they figure they can keep leeching off the G1 characters and plot by redoing the same story over and over and over because for some reason.... bw was different..admittedly it had a g1 tie-in but it had it's own story. how different of a story do you want? I would like a story on cybertron w/ no human interaction, but then hastak is probably worried that that might not appeal to kids. Well, to be fair, fans have been doing that since g1.. What needs to be done is hasbro should have their own show on this side of the pacific; one that isn't dubbed into english, one that is made for an american audience. Does hasbro really have a creative team for the toon, or at least one that does anything other than dub the most current toon into english? There isn't too much to work w/ there (not that they couldn't do better..).
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Post by CkRtech on Aug 14, 2006 18:36:05 GMT -5
I know for a fact that there are many people on the board that want the cartoons developed in the western hemisphere once again. Granted - they could very well still be animated in the East (although I hope it would be a different studio). But develop it in English first.
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Post by Bear on Aug 14, 2006 21:51:51 GMT -5
I know for a fact that there are many people on the board that want the cartoons developed in the western hemisphere once again. Granted - they could very well still be animated in the East (although I hope it would be a different studio). But develop it in English first. I think the big problem is that America doe not want to spend the money on the developement of a show. I would give most anything to see a GI Joe cartoon like the current Ninja Turtles
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Post by Gunman_sr5 on Aug 14, 2006 21:56:57 GMT -5
I know for a fact that there are many people on the board that want the cartoons developed in the western hemisphere once again. Granted - they could very well still be animated in the East (although I hope it would be a different studio). But develop it in English first. I think the big problem is that America doe not want to spend the money on the developement of a show. I would give most anything to see a GI Joe cartoon like the current Ninja Turtles Ah I would not say that money is the issue. Considering the most expensive Transformers comercial is in the works. How much is Hasbro spending on the movie anyways?
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Post by CkRtech on Aug 14, 2006 22:05:59 GMT -5
Well - movies and cartoons are totally different markets - plus the movie is not an animated movie.
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Post by Destro on Aug 14, 2006 22:06:07 GMT -5
I believe the budget for the movie is pretty high; speilberg is producing the thing, and I'm sure he doesn't come cheap.
I think money is an issue as far as the toon goes; hasbro knows that it's easier/cheaper to share the toon cost w/ takara than go on their own w/ an american-produced cartoon. The movie is obviously more of a risk that hopefully will pay off.
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